Capitalism BM & ST

[Dale Eastman]

Capitalism is basically a bully with monopoly on violence claiming something as his property and having papers to prove it.

Capitalism is inherently exploitive. Capitol = chattel.

➽ Capitalism is inherently exploitive. Capitol = chattel.

Hi B... Pedantic Asshole Dale here.

Nebulously defined terms have no place in serious discussions. I read your words as an invite to a serious discussion about..."Capitalism".

okay

I'm pretty sure I stuck the hook up the worm's butt.

Dale Eastman capitalism has nothing to do with property ownership or free trade does it? It has more in common with a hook up a worm's butt.

You and I do NOT have an agreement on what "capitalism" is...
Other than a 10 character word.

The relationship of X to Y or to Z can not be examined unless X is rigidly defined.

My not understanding exactly what 𝓨𝓞𝓤 mean when 𝓨𝓞𝓤 use the word-term "𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞" is severely limits communication and mutual understanding.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman does capitalism in it's current manifestation have anything to do with free markets or property ownership?

Dale Eastman what I mean is it's authoritarian collectivism and not anything an anarchist wants anything to do with.

Dale Eastman every time I debate with a supporter of capitalism they never agree with any dictionary definition and are not familiar with the etymology of the word. What's there even to debate?

Gentlemen, thank you for engaging in a "discussion" of "capitalism". I like that you are both positing questions which is what one does to dig for knowledge and understanding.

Gents, your anti-capitalism biases are showing. Let me rephrase that claim, Gents, your anti-this specific ism biases are showing.

In other words, I am aware that you are both against a certain something-ism. I have no clue as to what, exactly, it is that you are both "against". You both fail to define what this, (my word) "Evil" is that you are against.

Serg, you claim:
➽ every time I debate with a supporter of capitalism they never agree with any dictionary definition and are not familiar with the etymology of the word.

I feel your frustration. <SNIP!> (I just cut myself off from a distracting tangential rant. We can examine that later if you have interest later.)

➽ they are not familiar with the etymology of the word.

Pretty sad that I find myself giving you kudos for knowing what etymology is.

➽ What's there even to debate?

I have seen more than my share of ahem... cough... ptooey... discussions between capitalists and anti-capitalists...

Both sides talk right past each other because of no agreement on what the term means.

I like that you are at least focused on finding a defined and defining starting point. Taking my guidance from your statement, I am going to start with some dictionary definitions.

𝕎𝕚𝕜𝕚𝕡𝕖𝕕𝕚𝕒
𝒞𝒶𝓅𝒾𝓉𝒶𝓁𝒾𝓈𝓂 𝒾𝓈 𝒶𝓃 𝑒𝒸𝑜𝓃𝑜𝓂𝒾𝒸 𝓈𝓎𝓈𝓉𝑒𝓂 𝒷𝒶𝓈𝑒𝒹 𝑜𝓃 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝓅𝓇𝒾𝓋𝒶𝓉𝑒 𝑜𝓌𝓃𝑒𝓇𝓈𝒽𝒾𝓅 𝑜𝒻 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝓂𝑒𝒶𝓃𝓈 𝑜𝒻 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝒹𝓊𝒸𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃 𝒶𝓃𝒹 𝓉𝒽𝑒𝒾𝓇 𝑜𝓅𝑒𝓇𝒶𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃 𝒻𝑜𝓇 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝒻𝒾𝓉. 𝒞𝑒𝓃𝓉𝓇𝒶𝓁 𝒸𝒽𝒶𝓇𝒶𝒸𝓉𝑒𝓇𝒾𝓈𝓉𝒾𝒸𝓈 𝑜𝒻 𝒸𝒶𝓅𝒾𝓉𝒶𝓁𝒾𝓈𝓂 𝒾𝓃𝒸𝓁𝓊𝒹𝑒 𝒸𝒶𝓅𝒾𝓉𝒶𝓁 𝒶𝒸𝒸𝓊𝓂𝓊𝓁𝒶𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃, 𝒸𝑜𝓂𝓅𝑒𝓉𝒾𝓉𝒾𝓋𝑒 𝓂𝒶𝓇𝓀𝑒𝓉𝓈, 𝓅𝓇𝒾𝒸𝑒 𝓈𝓎𝓈𝓉𝑒𝓂𝓈, 𝓅𝓇𝒾𝓋𝒶𝓉𝑒 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝓅𝑒𝓇𝓉𝓎, 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝓅𝑒𝓇𝓉𝓎 𝓇𝒾𝑔𝒽𝓉𝓈 𝓇𝑒𝒸𝑜𝑔𝓃𝒾𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃, 𝓋𝑜𝓁𝓊𝓃𝓉𝒶𝓇𝓎 𝑒𝓍𝒸𝒽𝒶𝓃𝑔𝑒, 𝒶𝓃𝒹 𝓌𝒶𝑔𝑒 𝓁𝒶𝒷𝑜𝓇.

ℂ𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞 𝔻𝕖𝕗𝕚𝕟𝕚𝕥𝕚𝕠𝕟 & 𝕄𝕖𝕒𝕟𝕚𝕟𝕘 - 𝕄𝕖𝕣𝕣𝕚𝕒𝕞-𝕎𝕖𝕓𝕤𝕥𝕖𝕣
𝒞𝒶𝓅𝒾𝓉𝒶𝓁𝒾𝓈𝓂 𝓇𝑒𝒻𝑒𝓇𝓈 𝓉𝑜 𝒶𝓃 𝑒𝒸𝑜𝓃𝑜𝓂𝒾𝒸 𝓈𝓎𝓈𝓉𝑒𝓂 𝒾𝓃 𝓌𝒽𝒾𝒸𝒽 𝒶 𝓈𝑜𝒸𝒾𝑒𝓉𝓎'𝓈 𝓂𝑒𝒶𝓃𝓈 𝑜𝒻 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝒹𝓊𝒸𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃 𝒶𝓇𝑒 𝒽𝑒𝓁𝒹 𝒷𝓎 𝓅𝓇𝒾𝓋𝒶𝓉𝑒 𝒾𝓃𝒹𝒾𝓋𝒾𝒹𝓊𝒶𝓁𝓈 𝑜𝓇 𝑜𝓇𝑔𝒶𝓃𝒾𝓏𝒶𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃𝓈, 𝓃𝑜𝓉 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝑜𝓋𝑒𝓇𝓃𝓂𝑒𝓃𝓉, 𝒶𝓃𝒹 𝓌𝒽𝑒𝓇𝑒 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝒹𝓊𝒸𝓉𝓈, 𝓅𝓇𝒾𝒸𝑒𝓈, 𝒶𝓃𝒹 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝒹𝒾𝓈𝓉𝓇𝒾𝒷𝓊𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃 𝑜𝒻 𝑔𝑜𝑜𝒹𝓈 𝒶𝓇𝑒 𝒹𝑒𝓉𝑒𝓇𝓂𝒾𝓃𝑒𝒹 𝓂𝒶𝒾𝓃𝓁𝓎 𝒷𝓎 𝒸𝑜𝓂𝓅𝑒𝓉𝒾𝓉𝒾𝑜𝓃 𝒾𝓃 𝒶 𝒻𝓇𝑒𝑒 𝓂𝒶𝓇𝓀𝑒𝓉.

I place this next definition mostly as a reminder to myself as a segue to some of the contentious points in regard to capitalism. I'm not ready for this tangential distraction at this time. When it is time, I will engage on the specific points.

ℂ𝕒𝕞𝕓𝕣𝕚𝕕𝕘𝕖 𝔻𝕚𝕔𝕥𝕚𝕠𝕟𝕒𝕣𝕪
𝒶𝓃 𝑒𝒸𝑜𝓃𝑜𝓂𝒾𝒸 𝓈𝓎𝓈𝓉𝑒𝓂 𝒷𝒶𝓈𝑒𝒹 𝑜𝓃 𝓅𝓇𝒾𝓋𝒶𝓉𝑒 𝑜𝓌𝓃𝑒𝓇𝓈𝒽𝒾𝓅 𝑜𝒻 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝓅𝑒𝓇𝓉𝓎 𝒶𝓃𝒹 𝒷𝓊𝓈𝒾𝓃𝑒𝓈𝓈, 𝓌𝒾𝓉𝒽 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝑜𝒶𝓁 𝑜𝒻 𝓂𝒶𝓀𝒾𝓃𝑔 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝓇𝑒𝒶𝓉𝑒𝓈𝓉 𝓅𝑜𝓈𝓈𝒾𝒷𝓁𝑒 𝓅𝓇𝑜𝒻𝒾𝓉𝓈 𝒻𝑜𝓇 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑜𝓌𝓃𝑒𝓇𝓈

 ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀

Clearly, there is a connection between capitalism and profit. I have observed profit to be just as nebulously poorly defined as capitalism.

Discussion can not proceed absent agreement as to what, specifically, is meant by "profit". I deliberately fall silent on the different definitions I have seen bandied about...

Well... nearly silent. Anti-capitalists are anti-profit.

 ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀ ❀

Brett, I do not understand what 𝓨𝓞𝓤 mean when 𝓨𝓞𝓤 use the word-term "𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞". This severely limits communication and mutual understanding. I have stated this to you once already.

You ask:
➽ does capitalism in it's current manifestation have anything to do with free markets or property ownership?

You have failed to define for me exactly what 𝓨𝓞𝓤 mean when 𝓨𝓞𝓤 use the word-term "𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞".  Since I do not understand what you are asking me to compare, I simply can not give an answer.

You may as well ask me, Do mouse turds in it's current manifestation have anything to do with free markets or property ownership? This has the same logical connection as your question.

➽ what I mean is it's authoritarian collectivism and not anything an anarchist wants anything to do with.

Your imprecise use of words forces me to have to take your sentences apart word by word to attempt to understand the point or points you wish to present for myself and others to cogitate.

I am forced to assume that you intended to claim that capitalism is "authoritarian collectivism"...

Please define exactly what you mean by "authoritarian collectivism". Please be precise and articulate in doing so.

I am ignoring the red herring of the proper definition of anarchist.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman in actuality no individual owns anything or has any recognized rights by the system so the definitions of capitalism you presented are utter bullshit. That's my point, and thank you for supporting it with your observations of the fruitlessness of arguing about which type of slave plantation you live under.
Capitalism is a deceptive fiction of the ruling class. What else can I say about a system of collectivism, taxation, title trickery, exploitation, monopoly....

Dale Eastman authoritarian collectivism is any system in which some people rule others based on coercion and theft. It includes socialism, communism, fascism, technocracy, and capitalism. They're all slavery systems and the ruling class will use whichever works best for them.

It's simple. Capitalism though it claims so, doesn't actually recognize individual claims of ownership or property, nor does it have anything to do with free markets. It's strictly for the legally dead, that is corporations, not the living and lawful.

Dale Eastman thanks for kudos, asshole. Also, using all these definitions, who owns the shit? What if only the lucky few do? And having control of all essential resources, they enslaved everybody else as their capital, because, remember, human resource is capital as well, they own your lame ass too. And you proudly defend their right to do so.

0838--1122
164 minutes

ST: ➽ Dale Eastman thanks for kudos, asshole.

I gave an honest appreciation that you know what etymology is and you chose to interpret that appreciation as an insult.

BM: ➽ Dale Eastman in actuality no individual owns anything or has any recognized rights by the system so the definitions of capitalism you presented are utter bullshit.

My not understanding exactly what 𝓨𝓞𝓤 mean when 𝓨𝓞𝓤 use the word-term "𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞" is severely limits communication and mutual understanding... So be a good discussion pardner and present 𝓨𝓞𝓤𝓡 articulate and factual definition of 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞.

As to the rest of your unsupported opinion in that sentence, Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

BM: ➽ the definitions of capitalism you presented are utter bullshit.
ST: ➽ Dale Eastman every time I debate with a supporter of capitalism they never agree with any dictionary definition and are not familiar with the etymology of the word.

What, specifically, are the traits, properties, attributes, characteristics & elements of 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞? Neither of you have presented a cogent definition of 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞.

What the both of you have presented is that you are both against 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞, what-ever-the-fuck 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞 is, yet you fail to articulate logic and reason to sway me to agree with you that 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞-bad.

Sheesh! I'm to agree with you that some-thing-bad but neither of you can define what the bad thing is.

BM:➽ Capitalism is a deceptive fiction of the ruling class.

You make a claim about something 𝓨𝓞𝓤 have refused to cogently define... Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

BM:➽ What else can I say about a system of collectivism, taxation, title trickery, exploitation, monopoly....

Verifiable facts proving your claims, else Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

BM:➽ Dale Eastman authoritarian collectivism is any system in which some people rule others based on coercion and theft.

Thank you for addressing my question.
Sorry. My error. That definition does not compile.

What is collectivism?

DE:➽ I do not understand what 𝓨𝓞𝓤 mean when 𝓨𝓞𝓤 use the word-term "𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞".
BM:➽ It's simple. Capitalism though it claims so, doesn't actually recognize individual claims of ownership or property, nor does it have anything to do with free markets. It's strictly for the legally dead, that is corporations, not the living and lawful.

Sorry. You have not given me anything I can use to understand what 𝓨𝓞𝓤 mean when 𝓨𝓞𝓤 use the word-term "𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞".

ST: ➽ Also, using all these definitions,
ST: ➽ every time I debate with a supporter of capitalism they never agree with any dictionary definition

You can NOT have this both ways.

NOTICE: I have spent several 𝓨𝓔𝓐𝓡𝓢 attempting to understand what those such as yourself actually think in regard to 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝𝕚𝕤𝕞... In what appears to have been a mostly futile effort on my part.

ST: ➽ who owns the shit?

Yes. Who owns the shit?

What, specifically, are you referring to as "the shit"?
Once I understand what you are specifically referring to, then I can determine if I agree, disagree, or need more info.

ST: ➽ What if only the lucky few do?

Too much dangling, non defined "things".

ST: ➽ And having control of all essential resources,

Missing is the list of these "essential resources".

To be drilled down on in later discussion, What is being controlled and how is this control being exercised?

ST: ➽ they enslaved everybody else as their capital,

What, specifically, is 𝕔𝕒𝕡𝕚𝕥𝕒𝕝?

ST: ➽ because, remember, human resource is capital as well

You're missing a few details, so I can not at this time, sign off on that definition.

ST: ➽ they own your lame ass too.

That is what is referred to as a "naked assertion". EVIDENCE?

ST: ➽ And you proudly defend their right to do so.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman wow, that use of Latin... So smart. I know you expect me to google it, but I don't want to. Also, the cursive doesn't help your cause, because it's difficult to read, and I avoid difficulties.

Dale Eastman we're obviously not comprehending each other. I support free markets, property rights, and voluntary exchange. Capitalism is observably not those things though many claim it so. As an anarchist, I'm not one of them. From my perspective it's a masonic black lie that even I missed seeing for too long. Maybe it was insider trading Nancy Pelosi lecturing a university socialist on this country being capitalist that finally opened the door of recognition but my studies of the origins of the concept and how it's used made it clear its not what I want to adhere to, identify with, or live in, except only compared to every other form of vertical hierarchical collectivism.

108 minutes

Gentlemen,
I had a slight suspicion that you were both ANTCAPS from your first posts in this thread.

There are other labels that could be applied. I don't like those other labels because they are NOT precise as applicable definitions, so I reject them. In making up my own label, I simply have joined anti and capitalism for a singularly, precisely aimed definition.

I point out a second time, I have spent YEARS attempting to understand what ANTCAPS believe and why.

Neither of you have presented a cogent definition of CAPITALISM. Thus, neither of you have evinced an intent of proving your ANTCAP position.

ST: ➽ Dale Eastman wow, that use of Latin... So smart.

How does this sarcastic disrespect further your presentment that being an ANTCAP is correct? How is this to sway folks to your position?

ST: ➽ I know you expect me to google it, but I don't want to.

{SHRUG} Remaining an ignoranus (sic) is YOUR CHOICE. I'm big on free-will.

ST: ➽ Also, the cursive doesn't help your cause, because it's difficult to read,

Noted. I'll change my style to remove an excuse you are using to NOT engage in a meaningful discussion of the details surrounding CAPITALISM.

Nasty opine self-censored.

Speaking of not helping one's cause... Where's YOUR precise definition of CAPITALISM?

ST: ➽ and I avoid difficulties.

You're lazy. Got it. I'll do my best to write at a 3rd grade level.

BM: ➽ Dale Eastman we're obviously not comprehending each other.

That is a 100 % correct statement. In other words: Yep. I agree.

BM: ➽ I support free markets, property rights, and voluntary exchange.

For the moment I am going to assume those three points mean the same to both of us.

BM: ➽ Capitalism is observably not those things though many claim it so.

That is not a hard edged definition of CAPITALISM... Hence our failure to communicate.

BM: ➽ As an anarchist, I'm not one of them.

I am forced to assume you meant you are not one of those that think CAPITALISM is free markets, property rights, voluntary exchange.

I acknowledge you have presented three things that CAPITALISM is NOT per your thinking. You have still not presented what, specifically, YOU mean when YOU use the word CAPITALISM.

BM: ➽ From my perspective it's a masonic black lie that even I missed seeing for too long.

Red herring. Value= 0.0

BM: ➽ except only compared to every other form of vertical hierarchical collectivism.

Second inquiry: What is collectivism?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman capitalism is a spook. That's it, it's a made up black magic word of the ruling class hiding behind the BAR mafia. I don't care what you call me. I don't have to understand perfectly how bullshit got here, what it's exact contents are, or why, to know it's bullshit and not capitalism. I went through the ancap stage. I used to think anarchy, capitalism, and freedom were basically synonymous, but I hadn't yet discovered the legal duplicitous treachery that kept me blind for my whole life. Examples of the true ownership include a certificate of title, motor vehicle registration, and property tax. No one truly owns anything so how can you call it a free market? That's like saying slaves swapping chores on the plantation are capitalists. I can't give you a clear definition of capitalism in so many words. Best I can tell it is a bit of colonialism, piracy, slave trading, and how large fictional criminal entities do business.

BM: ➽ I can't give you a clear definition of capitalism in so many words.
BM: ➽ Dale Eastman we're obviously not comprehending each other.

Do you think those two issues might... Just might... be related?

I understand that you are against CAPITALISM. Since you can't give a clear definition of what CAPITALISM is, then you can't give me an understanding of what, specifically, you are against. You then attempt conflation to bring things not within the definition in as if those things are the definition.

You rejected the few dictionary definitions I presented as a starting point to discuss what CAPITALISM is. I can set those definition to the side for now.

What does the term PROFIT mean to you?

In capitalism, you either own/control serious capital, or you are human capital. So which is it with you? What kind of capital do you own? Please be laconic. I don't have time for another essay.

Dale Eastman we're slaves arguing over the bullshit concepts given to us by the overlords who will never let us own anything or trade freely.

Capitalism = Corporatism. Even an individual must use his corporate personhood to access commerce.

ST: ➽ Please be laconic. I don't have time for another essay.

TRANSLATION: He doesn't want to support his undefined beliefs. Just swallow his conflations un-critically,

ST: ➽ In capitalism, you either own/control serious capital, SNIP!

What, exactly, do you mean with that particular use of the word capital? NOTE: At the moment, I am only interested in your first use to the word.

ST: ➽ In capitalism, [...] or you are human capital.

At this moment, I am interested in What, exactly, do you mean with that particular phrase?

ST: ➽ What kind of capital do you own?

What kind of WHAT do I own and keep in my sock drawer?

BM: ➽ Dale Eastman we're slaves.

Some more than others. I accept that comment at face value as I have quoted it.

BM: ➽ Dale Eastman we're slaves arguing over the bullshit concepts

You and I ARE NOT arguing over the single concept of CAPITALISM. You have NOT defined what the concept of CAPITALISM actually is, so how the fuck am I going to argue with you in regard to this concept?

BM: ➽ Dale Eastman we're slaves arguing over the bullshit concepts given to us by the overlords.

The concepts given to us by the overlords is something entirely different from the concept of CAPITALISM. Have you bothered to look through my website?

BM: ➽ Capitalism = Corporatism.

What, exactly, do you mean by your use of the word CORPORATISM?

BM: ➽ Even an individual must use his corporate personhood to access commerce.

What, exactly, do you mean by your use of the word COMMERCE?

SECOND INQUIRY: What does the term PROFIT mean to you?

Dale Eastman commerce as defined and regulated by the corporate BAR cabal, covering all the land with legal commercial systems.... have you not looked into your Birth Certificate Corporate Person?
Profit is a legal term I'm sure.
There is no sense carrying this on, we're not speaking the same language or something. I told you capitalism as it is defined and how it functions in society is a spook. You want me to define imaginary for you? Corporatism I could define in great detail encompassing all most all facets of life from the individual's assigned NAME, to government corps to Raytheon to teachers unions to the courts. ALL COMMERCE and governed by commercial fictional institutions seeking ill gotten gains.

Dale Eastman my conclusion is, you don't even know what capital is if you think you can fit it in your socks. And by the way you're dodging my questions.

DE: ➽ What, exactly, do you mean by your use of the word COMMERCE?
BM: ➽ Dale Eastman commerce as defined and regulated by the corporate BAR cabal, covering all the land with legal commercial systems.... have you not looked into your Birth Certificate Corporate Person?

I DID NOT ask you about the "corporate BAR cabal's definition did I?
I asked you:
What, exactly, do you mean by your use of the word COMMERCE?

DE: ➽ What does the term PROFIT mean to you?
BM: ➽ Profit is a legal term I'm sure.

You DID NOT answer my question.

BM: ➽ There is no sense carrying this on, we're not speaking the same language or something.

YOU are the communication error. You use words, I ask you to provide what you mean by your use of those words. You are unable to do so.

BM: ➽ I told you capitalism as it is defined and how it functions in society is a spook.

Dale... Remember, his insanity is part of your reality.

Recap: You're against CAPITALISM but you are unable to define what it actually is so I can understand what you are against.

Lemme put the context up to shed light to better understand your stated conclusion.

ST: ➽ In capitalism, you either own/control serious capital, SNIP!
DE: ➽ What, exactly, do you mean with that particular use of the word capital? 
ST: ➽ What kind of capital do you own?
DE: ➽ What kind of WHAT do I own[...]

Dale Eastman my conclusion is, you don't even know what capital is if you think you can fit it in your socks.

You have YET to present a definition of CAPITAL.

ST: ➽ And by the way you're dodging my questions.

I told you, I am a pedantic asshole. Here's the questions you asked and the date-time Fecalbook logged them.

17 June 22:07What's there even to debate?
18 June 14:29Also, using all these definitions, who owns the shit?
18 June 14:29What if only the lucky few do?
21 June 09:13So which is it with you?
21 June 09:13What kind of capital do you own?

Perhaps you will re-ask the question you have become anxious that I fail\ed to address in a more precise manner?

Dale Eastman It's really simple. I only care about a free market and property rights. Capitalism provides neither, prove me wrong.

in capitalism, those who have, are making profits, and the have-nots are contributing to the profits of those who have.

Capital is made up wealth in a debt based criminal empire, that's why the ism doesn't make any sense.

BM: ➽ Dale Eastman It's really simple. I only care about a free market and property rights. Capitalism provides neither, prove me wrong.

Let me make sure I'm understanding your challenge. I'm supposed to prove you wrong about a concept you refuse to define?

BM: ➽ Capital is made up wealth in a debt based criminal empire,

What, specifically, do YOU mean by WEALTH?

Dale Eastman wealth is just paper. No one owns anything! Title is held by the corporate state. Capital is bank printing fiat and charging interest.

I can't define a made up word but you can't reconcile reality with the definition if your made up bullshit ruling class word.

Dale Eastman can you reconcile the definition with the reality on the ground? I can't, that's why I attack it. I have alternatives and solutions but I can't redefine something that makes no sense from the start.